Responses to Presentations in Second Renaissance Explorer Course v4 [April 2026]

Preface

This text was recently shared in the WhatsApp group for the course “From Metacrisis to Second Renaissance”. It is a response paper to the first four whitepapers as well as the course.

After our third course session I added the section of “Appendix 1: Further comments”, in which I seek to make my arguments more clear, cohesive, and add a little extra. In addition to this, I also included “artifacts” to be included in my description of “culture”.

I welcome all comments.

Introduction

First, a big thanks to Rufus, Sylvie, the other helpers, and Lifeitself for offering this “From Metacrisis to Second Renaissance” course and for showing up with such spirit and commitment. Also a special thanks to Rufus, for welcoming any kind of comments around the course, including even “dissident” voices, time will show if he will regret this.

Prior to starting this course, I have read the first four “whitepapers” available from the Lifeitself website. I can only encourage other people to read these. They contain a lot of information, they make an excellent analysis, they bring things together and it is all written in what I would say is a very accessible language. Now we are in between the 2nd and 3rd session of the course, and all my comments are based upon these whitepapers and the course so far.

Reading through the whitepapers, some let’s say resistance or hesitation did present itself for me. In addition to this, I have been working on something for quite a while, which also cuts into this overall presentation. This has resulted in what I call the three issues. Issue 1 is a more in-depth explanation of the comment I made in our last session, in regards to the overall framework of the course, where I suggested a different approach. Issue 2 is regarding the word “inner”, which comes up quite many times throughout the whitepapers. I will try to explain what I find problematic about this and how an alternative view about this might look like. Issue 3 is regarding my own work and how I think that some new discoveries fundamentally could change the whole scenery about how we go about this and where we could end up.

Issue 1: What approach?

The approach of the whitepapers and the course

Both the whitepapers and the course makes use of this framework, which is analogous to a medical approach, and also close to how the Buddha framed his Four Noble Truths. Below is the four week list:

Week 1: Symptoms of the Crisis: The Polycrisis

Week 2: A Diagnosis: The Metacrisis

Week 3: Prognosis: We Can Evolve and Heal

Week 4: Treatment: The Path to Renaissance

In addition to this, the course also suggests four different layers of depth:

  1. Surface, - “symptoms”, manifelt crisis

  2. Intermediate, structures and technologies

  3. Root - cultural paradigm, modernity

  4. Root - human nature, deep tendencies

A different approach

As I said in our last call, I wish to present a different approach, which is:

  1. What is the situation now?

  2. Where would we like to end up? (Our ideal)

  3. What plans and actions are needed to realize this?

These three are of equal importance and interdependent. There is however an order of how you approach it, first 1, then 2, then 3.

There are at least three advantages to this approach as I see it.

Advantage 1

The first advantage is a part of an answer to what Victor was asking about in our last call, which was about if these “problems” that we “identified” were “real or not”.

So let me start somewhere else. I think the way that most lets say school and academic papers today are structured, is that they basically start out with a “problem formulation” (you are describing a problem, that you then spend your text trying to address).

I think it would be much better, if papers instead started with what is essentially a “wish”, something good you want to achieve. “Problems” in this view, would then potentially naturally arise, as you try to achieve your wish. You start with a wish, and what prevents you from realizing this, you could refer to as a problem. So in this sense, problems are not something in themselves, but rather a part of a larger whole, where we humans are actually valuing something, and then from this valuing, a problem can be said to exist.

So coming back to the framework. In step 1 we “describe” and understand present reality as deeply as we can. However, one does not need to hold very firmly on to what they think are “problems” here. Problems exist in a context. Rather, it is more important to see things in terms of “description” which is to say “trying to understand how things are and are related”. Of course, there may be many things that we rather be without or be different, but then identifying what is possible to change and how change most effectively can happen, is what is important.

The second step is asking, where really would we like to end up? Including all values, all institutions, everything happening etc. This has to be realistic in the sense of adhering to physical laws, our human nature, etc.

Finally then, making plans and continuing to realize them.

So, coming back to the course framework, I think this approach ensures that whatever we are doing, this would be linked to valued reasons for doing it.

Advantage 2

The second reason for preferring this approach kinda follows in the wake of the first reason. I would just outright claim that there exists more intrinsic motivation in “trying to achieve what you really would like” rather than “solving a problem”.

Sure, if you are ill, you would normally have a natural motivation to get well again. But then again, isn’t the motivation here coming from the wish to return to a state where you felt better and/or were able to do more? If our motivation in a large part comes from moving towards something we really value, why do we not put what we really value, at the very forefront of our endeavors?

So I think reframing this, giving a larger emphasis on something positive that we would like, rather than to avoid something bad, would give more overall and sustained motivation.

Advantage 3

The third advantage has to do with how I see “action” in general.

Should I try to define “action”, I would define it, in this exact same way. Every “action”, in my understanding of what I mean by action, consists of an understanding of the present situation, some kind of “ideal”, and then having a plan for realizing this ideal and carrying it out.

I would say that “action” is quite an interesting concept. For example, you can think of an action as you sitting in a café and feeling thirsty (situation), would like to drink something (ideal), you reaching for some drink on the table or ordering something if you haven’t yet (a plan and carrying out the plan).

But, how “large” is an “action”? What about “making dinner”? Could we think about making dinner some day, as being one action? Because in making dinner, there could very well be many smaller actions coming together around making a full dinner, for example finding pots and pans, cutting different vegetables, cooking, arranging, etc.

How about attending a three year college program? What about the wish to become a buddhist monk, living in a monastery with the aim of becoming “enlightened”?

I am of the view that in fact we could put anything into the bracket of “an action”. How exactly to understand and discriminate an action then is not entirely clear for me, but I would say that there would have to be an intention along with a specific goal. In a large sense, it is the intention that keeps an “action” “alive”. Of course, intention is one thing, the reality we live in is another. You may have the intention of cooking one evening, but then you end up burning the only food you had available, and you decide to get take-away instead.

Anyways, the reason why I think it is important that the overall framework aligns with (at least how I see) an “action”, is because then this whole process of investigation becomes more organic.

If we get information in a way that aligns with what an action is, then it just becomes more intuitive, more simple and more accessible, rather than receiving information that we would then have to reorder afterwards.

Issue 2: The “Inner” “Outer” Distinction

The use of “Inner” and “Outer” today

Throughout the four whitepapers there is a heavy use of the “inner” “outer” distinction, often just talking about the “inner” side or “inner” development or things like that.

This distinction is also made by Ken Wilber in his AQAL model. I don’t know if he was the originator of this distinction, here is a AI quote about Wilbers model:

“Ken Wilber’s Integral Theory (AQAL) maps reality using four quadrants, splitting perspectives into inner (subjective/interior) vs. outer (objective/exterior) and individual vs. collective. This framework ensures a complete view by combining interior intentions/culture with exterior behaviors/systems, acknowledging that all four dimensions exist simultaneously in any human experience.”

Also for example the notion of inner is central for the new initiative of “Inner Developmental Goals” (https://innerdevelopmentgoals.org/).

This is to say that this distinction is very widely used, at least in this “Liminal Web” space.

However, I believe that there are some fundamental problems with this distinction that I would like to go into.

The helpfullness and unhelpfullness of this distinction

So first off, it is not that I am against this distinction per se. It can be useful in some circumstances, highlighting some certain aspect or emphasizing something. The problem arises if you put it as something really fundamental, such as Wilber has done and I think also the whitepapers do. For me, this is definitely not a fundamental distinction, and to see it this way, is really misleading and affects how you view human nature, our ability to act, what culture is, etc.

To put it very simple, this model lends itself to the belief that what we can really do is around this inner aspect, how we see, feel, approach things, and then we are living in this world of “structures”, “institutions”, “buildings” etc., which more or less are the way they are. These “outer” things could of course also be changed, but that is really a process in its own right, and you would probably need to look at something like the “political” to go about that.

An alternative way of seeing these matters

Ok, so is there a more “true” or “close to reality” way of seeing this? Below I would like to present the outskirts of a model that I made roughly 6 years ago. This model is actually the sketch of a full on attempt at making a Theory of Everything (ToE). This model as such attempts to capture all of reality, yet also making divisions, distinctions, and orderings as to how things conceptually could be organized. There are 9 headlines, each representing a major organizing principle. Everything is interconnected. Also, you can view it as being ordered in a grid, where 1, 2, 3 belongs to column 1. 4, 5, 6, belongs to column 2. 7, 8, 9, belongs to column 3. You could also see it the other way, where 1, 4, 7, would be row 1, and etc. Also again, this is really a highly unfinished and flawed sketch, which can only maybe give a basic idea about some things.

Ok, so I would like you to look at the definition of 9. Culture. In addition to what I wrote 6 years ago, I would like to just add some content to this definition. “Culture” also includes shared values, norms, practices. These are again embedded in our actions, what we do. Culture then, is also value-laden actions, which are shared in a group. The results of these actions, buildings, artifacts, etc. could also be seen as part of culture.

Ok, then I would like you to notice how culture is situated among the 8 other headlines. Also notice how culture is in a sense the “last” of these headlines, it is the end of both the column and row way of looking at this. So, in a sense, everything else is leading to culture.

1. Universe

The Universe is all, the universe is everything. All things, planets, people, atoms, are part of the universe.

2. Experience

There is experience. Each one of us experiences the world. Experience constitutes everything that we are aware of. There is also understanding. Understanding is how each of us understands ourself and the world in which we are in. The experience and understanding we have are part of the universe.

A subdivision of this part consists of experience, understanding, and perspective.

3. Symbols

Symbols come into being by referring to something else. There is much focus on written language as symbols but perhaps we should pay more attention to oral language.

4. Unfolding

The Universe is constantly unfolding. There is entropy. There is change. There is complexity.

5. Belief

There is belief. Belief is that which you act upon. Some other animals may have a version of beliefs as well.

A subdivision of this part consists of learning, believing, and practicing.

6. Creating

By creating it means the ability to relate to the world in an abstract way and make things which did not exist before such as symbols, technology or institutions.

What kind of processes did words like “hello” or “thank you” originate from? What meaning were those sounds meant to convey? Symbols are part of the human experience.

7. Propositions

There are propositions. Many of the things written in this model are propositions. A proposition could be: ‘the sun is hot’.

There are also judgements and standards. With judgements a standard is used and something is judged according to this standard.

There is narrative.

8. Communication

Communication in some form can exist between all living organisms. Communication is the exchange of some matter, energy or information between organisms.

9. Culture

The culture in this sense means that there are interpretations, understandings and stories embedded in symbols which are inherited from past generations and given to new generations.

Culture, what we share, and the necessity of abstraction

Ok, so to try to sum up on this. So in a large and simple sense, what we do, which is shared among us, could be called culture. But I guess this is also misleading because, then in what way does culture distinguish itself from let’s say other animals who also “share behavior”? So, when I am talking about this thing that is shared, this can not be based upon instinct or efficiency alone. This has to have an abstract element.

Abstraction is when “something” is taken “out of” a “whole picture” and “looked at” in “isolation” [sorry for the excessive use of quotation marks]. In other words, it is the ability to in principle consider something in-and-of-itself, in relation to whatever it may be.

When I am talking about something which is shared in a culture, there would be an element of abstraction to it. It is exactly because there is an element of abstraction to it, that we can share something among ourselves in a non-idiosyncratic or situation-bound way. On another note, one might also say that to the degree that other animals, can have abstract thought, they can also have culture.

The analogy of the fish in water

Okay, but still how is this directly relevant with the whitepapers etc.? So in the whitepapers, and I believe there will be in the 3rd course session, there is the analogy of the fish in water. If I interpret the analogy correctly, the analogy is that we could perhaps say that “fish don’t know that they are in water, because they have always been there, and know of nothing else”. [I guess flying fish are an exception to this, since they do experience “air”. Perhaps they are in constant deep metaphysical speculation and are constantly frustrated by the fact that other fish do not get their points] This is interesting because we as humans are familiar with let’s say “ground”, “air”, more stuff, and then also “water”. So we, from the “outside”, can say that the “fish is in water” and “how would a fish know what water is, if it knows nothing else?”.

You can then try to transfer the analogy to humans by saying that in a sense, humans are also born somewhere, they are perhaps told the world is such and such a place and they have their own experiences, and it is sort of “ok, this is it, this is what it is”. That in a sense you consider the reality as what it is, and that it is immutable.

To “see the water” or “know you are in water” is then to realize that there is a history to everything, many things are created one way or the other, that things may be some way now but that this was not set, given, by necessity and that things could be different.

And then, if I understand the presentation correctly, the analogy stops. Which I think is not taking this analogy as deep as you could go with it. So there are two things I would like to add on to this analogy.

Two additions to the analogy of the fish

First addition

So for me, realizing we are in water, that it is in some sense created, the real question then is: What kind of water do we want? We are in part creating this water, so let us take ownership and consider this question.

Second addition

The second addition to the analogy going away from considering “all of reality” to simply considering “culture”. So, let us again imagine being the fish, and all we are experiencing now is “culture”. What actually does this look like? Ok, so first of all, we could say we see other fish. How every other fish moves. Second we could also see the results of these fishes movement, the artifacts being created. So there are other fish moving and the results of this movement over time.

Concluding thoughts on why the “inner” “outer” is problematic

I hope with this fish example, that I have made it clear what I find problematic about the “inner”, “outer”, distinction as a central thing. What we do is the culture. There is no layer in between our actions and our culture. And of course, you and what you do, is part of culture.

So for example, I have seen some examples where some people would say that “institutions” are “not part of culture” (I do not know if the white papers express this view or not, it’s not explicit at least). But so, buildings are human made, and there are values behind building them. That people would go in and out of these buildings every day is a human practice, it is culture. The institutions we have today are a part of the culture we have today.

So my concluding point here is that not having any intermediate layer between us and culture is absolutely central if we were to have any wishes of shaping our culture. I think the inner, outer framework is lending itself to seeing a layer, and therefore I think it is problematic.

Issue 3: Introducing a new logic

Is a new logic possible?

The 3rd issue is really about omitting something. Nowhere in the whitepapers is there a mention of a possible new logic. This is however not so surprising, as I am not aware of any place in our present day discourse, where there is a mention of a new higher logic.

So here I am, claiming that a new higher logic, possibly could exist. The existence of this logic would not only change what society we might have in the future but also what path we might take to end up in such a society.

Brief description of the logic

I will just briefly describe the new logic here. The description below is from a session I had at the 2026 Limicon. The description is paired with the title of: “Is it possible for one framework to contain ‘anything’/‘everything’?" Below the description is a link to the actual presentation I gave, which gives an overview of the logic.

“Well, if we use mainstream logic (with one or more premises leading to a conclusion), I would say it is not possible.

However, what if an approach to logic existed which had infinite complexity and at the same time everything being connected? How would that look like?

Secondly, how do you feel about the idea that ‘smaller ideas’ could be contained in ‘larger ideas’ (e.g. golden retriever, dog, mammal, animal, (and finally) the universe)? And that this would go from the ‘very bottom’ to the ‘very top’?

Ok, if you could imagine this, could I then ask you, what would be the 9 ideas at the very top? The 9 ideas that would contain all other ideas?

I make a guess about which 9 ideas this might be.”

Presentation: https://drive.google.com/file/d/19rIPduDQhvPLo_0Zd9pFoo8DPA4zLl9G/view?usp=sharing.

It is important to emphasize that what I am sharing here, is not an actual working model for what this logic is or how it works. It is rather work that speaks to the possibility of there existing a logic along these lines. In order to suggest something so abstract such as this, you would also need an actual sketch of how it might look like, which there is in a rather few words.

The overall claims

So what are the claims, in regards to this new logic? The overall claim is that any and all content/information/knowledge//(call it what you want) could be included into this framework. This would mean that all disciplines, traditions/“religions”, could be understood and included in the same framework. This changes quite literally “everything”.

Where do we go from here?

Ok, so where do we go from here? Before anything else, we should first examine whether this new logic exists or not. In the case that it seems to exist, we would then need to get to know it, what is it really? How is it grounded? How does it work? And also trying to apply it in different areas and see what results come.

I believe that everything being equal and there being no resistance, then humans will prefer “truth” over “not truth”. The same thing also applies to “success” over “not success”, everything being equal and no resistances.

The academic system as an early point of cultural change

One way to proceed further from this could be by asking “what function does the academic system have in society?” An answer to this might be something like “To hold and share knowledge and do research”. Central to the academic system is the notion of “science”.

How well understood and defined is “science” today? Is there an agreement in the academic system about what the best understanding of what science is?

Ok, so one claim I would make is that it is possible to create a more rigorous, intuitive, true, useful and fruitful understanding of “science” than what currently exists. With this I also mean that anything that the academic system today is holding or creating, could also exist in this new logical framework I am suggesting. Nothing real would be lost. Then there are things that are, let’s say, “less clear”, and worse than this, that also exist in the academic system today, which could be cleared up.

My basic claim here is that this new logic is equal to or better than the existing academic system in every possible way. So, then we can go back to the idea that “humans like success”. I believe that if we could show/demonstrate this new logic, how it works, what it is capable of, basically this could persuade some people to look more into it. As soon as some people look into it, and a conversation arises from it, you could view this as a “self-propagating dynamic”. This is to say that, as long as it could be shown that the new is better than the old, everything being equal, then more and more would come to use the new logical system, rather than the old understanding.

Cultural change with this new logic

So, this is also to say, that if we ask the question of: “How do we make a large cultural change happen?” The answer here might be very simple. Only if we actually could prove that something more fruitful is possible, could a large change happen, but then if we could, this larger change would also be self-evident (everything being equal).

So, the potential of this new logic existing, fundamentally changes how I view and approach the question of cultural change and the best way forward.

And so, like I said in the beginning of this issue, the whitepapers do not consider the existence of such a logic, and are therefore suggesting an approach forward, which is different from how I would go about it.

Appendix 1: Further comments

Just to be clear, the critique I made about the “inner” “outer” distinction in issue 2, is really a critique of the inner, outer distinction that Ken Wilber makes in his AQAL model. Out of everything Wilber had made, I believe you could say, this is the most fundamental. It splits “reality” into four quadrants. And as I see it, these whitepapers are in part based upon these views by Wilber.

What I am saying then is that if you believe in this AQAL model of Wilbers, then you will see things differently. It will affect your perception. How we perceive things is not some minor detail, it is at the very core of everything.

What I am saying is, that there is a very large difference between seeing “laws”, “institutions”, and “technology” as either “part of culture” or “outside of culture”.

I think that the most accurate headline for our third session could be: “Is cultural transformation possible?” As someone who sees institutions, technology, laws, etc. as part of culture, this question makes little sense. For me, this question only makes sense, if you see certain human made things as “outside” culture, then, how do you deal with that? How do you handle that? Can you change this or not? While if you see it as part of culture you would say, yes it is something we do, yes we can change what we do.

I think something very relevant for this area is the question of “How do we see ourselves, others and the world?” Much could be said about this in different times and places, but let me just jump straight into medieval Europe. So quite clearly there was a “god”, who was also “the lord”. This being had created everything, including us, knew everything that was going on, and it was by his graces, that something good might happen to us. There was a very clear hierarchy here, where this god was above humans. This was directly correlated with the word of this god, the Bible. Knowledge was in the Bible and you could read the Bible and gain knowledge. This also meant that there was a certain view of how we learn.

I will just claim it outright and make no further arguments for it, but my basic view is that this basic view of what knowledge is and what learning is, carried into the universities and more properly into what we could call the academic system later. Today, there are a variety of views about knowledge and learning in the academic system, but I would say that the root, the core, is the same.

I am claiming that this view of us humans having someone “above us”, has carried through to our present day and it is just what is taken for granted. For me, the most obvious example for this is perhaps in journalism, where I really feel that the vast majority of journalists are either ignoring their own role (as humans, journalists, people with influence, etc) as participants in creating our culture. Or they see their role as something very superficial and not fundamental. [I guess this is more true in places like Denmark/Europe, where many journalists see themselves as “neutral” (or maybe “not here”), while in the US they tend to take a more active, participatory role.]

I will also say that it does not make much sense to say to for example a journalist: “Hey, journalist, why are you not more self-conscious about your own influence and thereby more reflected on what responsibilities this might imply?” Because, we as humans believe stuff, we believe in different stories. A change like this could not happen from critiquing. Instead, what we would need to do is to present a new coherent story, where our role of us creating the culture we live in, is so.

Coming back to the whitepapers, I guess I do also wanna say that if I were to have made an “Issue 4”, and an “Issue 5”, these would possibly have been: “What about intention?” and “What about learning?” Intention is maybe even more important than learning, but still for me, if we are talking about personal development and cultural change, intention and learning are absolut central ideas. In the whitepapers I think these two ideas are mentioned a few times in passing, but they are not central. So I am suspicious of this.

Finally then, if we change our view of culture to include laws, institutions, technology, etc. I think this also opens up something else, which I briefly mentioned in issue 3. This is the matter of what “role” or “function” does in the culture has? So for me, the most relevant area of our culture to look at, is the academic system. The academic system is the most deciding factor in determining whether something is “true” or “not true”, in our culture. This is just so much at the heart of everything we have been writing and I could not imagine talking about larger cultural changes in the positive direction, without meeting the academic system.

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Thanks @Rasmus for this extensive contribution!

My hope is to incorporate these ideas in our subcircle research process (next session - May 8) on unpacking the 2R white papers.

To quickly summarize @Rasmus ‘s key points, here are three quick main ideas:

  1. is goal-directed action an improvement over diagnosis/cure or problem/solution thinking?

  2. are there better frameworks than Wilber’s AQAL, in particular the inner/outer distinction?

  3. can a proposed multi-dimensional Theory of Everything improve on current logics?

I invite anyone to respond to these questions here in print, or to bring responses to the next subcircle Zoom call on May 8. Prior to this paper by @Rasmus my thinking in regards to the May 8 session revolved around the question of “how can inner work or inner space affect cultural change?” I believe Rasmus’s three main points speak to this, especially point 2). So discussing the paper (and the underlying whitepapers) seems advantageous for exploring the topic I had in mind anyway!

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I’d like to find out more about your objections. I don’t feel you’ve made it clear enough.
You can apply inner and outer to a lot of things - and if we start with trust, for example

not trusting others will revert you into your inner and affect a lot of other systems - your perspectives, wordview and actions.

having high level of trust will allow you to have collective ideals, cohere around common purpose.

Then at lower level, you can talk about conscious and subsconscious. The quadrants are always there but you have a choice or potential to move between them. Happy to talk about it because it’s fundamental to understanding of how it affects futuristic vision and action.

Thank you for your response. Obviously, discussing the AQAL model is a very deep discussion. I will try to expand my critique of the model.

Perception

First I wish to talk about perception, or what do we see and why do we see what we see? So very briefly I will claim that what we see is based upon previous interpreted compressed experience. So for example, at one point in your life, perhaps someone said “car” and pointing towards something moving or holding still (or a picture thereof), a vehicle of some kind. Later on, as we hear more about “cars” and we see more of what we believe to be “cars” we update our idea of “cars”. And, we see/perceive on the basis of the ideas that we have.

Now, do you and I, the people of the forum, or everyone in the world, share the same idea of what a “car” is? No we do not, and we could not in principle, we all come to understand what a “car” is, based upon our own unique experiences and how it is interpreted. However, of course, there could be a large or very large overlap between our idea of what a car is, and it is this overlap that allows us meaningfully to talk about “cars” together.

What about other things besides cars, what about “democracy”? Or a specific person? What about the “sun”? The “Earth”? Same applies.

Alan Watts

Now I would like to briefly introduce another perspective on this. For better and/or worse, Alan Watts did influence me quite much back in the day. One of the things he said was: “a thing is a think”. With this he meant that, it is not like there is this independent/separate “thing” out there in the world, and then you have your own “thought”/“idea” about this thing. No rather, there is an equivalence between the two. Personally, I do think it makes sense just to say this either. I would say that this is one way you can look at it, as there are more ways you can view something.

Modernity’s view of “Perception”

Throughout the whitepapers, the notion of “modernity” is very central. So I would just like to make an additional comment to this as well. I would say that one of the absolut key defining characteristics of the ‘modern’ view, is its view of “perception”. As an “exemplar” of this modern view, I will use the book by Alan Chalmers, “What is This Thing Called Science?” (2013, Fourth edition). This was the textbook of a philosophy of science class that I was given in a university course.

Ok, so to say it briefly. There is a chapter dedicated to discussion perception (“Observation as practical intervention”). In this chapter there is a discussion around the question “do we see reality as it is or not?” In the chapter there are some objections why this is not the case, these objections are then addressed in some way. Ok, so the point I am trying to make here is that, the chapter actually acknowledges that there could be some things that points towards the notion that “we do not just see how things are”, but moving forward, the first page of the next chapter reads: “In this chapter I assume for the sake of argument that secure facts can be established by careful use of the senses.” (Chalmers 2013, p. 25). And the rest of the book relies on this assumption. Just to add a bit further to this trend. The following chapter is about discussing the idea of “facts”. Can you guess what the first page of the following chapter says? “Let us assume, then, that appropriate facts can be established in science” (Chalmers 2013, p. 38). For all times sake, I think that in regards to how “science” is being carried out today, I think its motto could be: “We acknowledge there may have been some discussion about what is and how research should be done, but going forward we will assume that this is not relevant.”

Ok, so what am I saying here? I am saying that a core part of the assumptions of modernity is that we basically “see reality as it is” or “see things how they really are”. In regards to Wilber, I do not believe he shares this view. However, I have not read enough of Wilber to understand how he understands perception. However, I do get a certain feel, that Wilber falls into a kind of trap, where he does not consider perception deeply enough.

Charles Peirce

Ok, then I would like to shift gears a little, introduce a new thinker, and end up presenting a new model.

I am going to cheat here, and include passages that I have previously written, in a text about Peirce. My own thinking about reality and our possibilities of knowing stuff is very influenced by Peirce and I also think he brings out some very fundamental ideas, so I think it is a worthwhile read.

I write:

[The reason why you cannot definitively prove what Peirce means by reality is that he defines reality as independent of what anybody thinks about it, see below. Since reality is considered independent of what we think about it, it also follows that reality is independent of what anybody writes about it, since that writing is an expression of thoughts.

"There are Real things, whose characters are entirely independent of our opinions about them; those Reals affect our senses according to regular laws, and, though our sensations are as different as are our relations to the objects, yet, by taking advantage of the laws of perception, we can ascertain by reasoning how things really and truly are; and any man, if he have sufficient experience and he reason enough about it, will be led to the one True conclusion. " (Peirce 1992, p. 120).

In How to Make Our Ideas Clear, he writes: "Thus we may define the real as that whose characters are independent of what anybody may think them to be. " (Peirce 1992, p. 137).

How to make sense of the above? The conclusion therefore is that there can exist no rational belief for “reality” since any attempt at such a proof would involve language, which could never in principle “capture” or “affect” what Peirce means by reality.

However, if I understand Peirce correctly he is saying that what we think could be what is real. However, there is no way to be certain of this. The only thing one can do is to try out one’s beliefs and see what happens, and the result may then strengthen the belief that the current beliefs one holds are in fact corresponding to the real.

This also goes back to the previous description of how doubt is the only thing that could ground inquiry and how we could not in principle know whether we have arrived at a false belief or a true belief. As Peirce writes: "The most that can be maintained is, that we seek for a belief that we shall think to be true. " (Peirce 1992, p. 114).

The conclusion here is then that one simply has to give up the notion of absolute certainty in regards to “truth”.

Citation:

Peirce, C. S., Houser, N., Kloesel, C. J. W., & Peirce Edition Project. (1992). The essential Peirce: Selected philosophical writings. “The Fixation of Belief” [extract] (p. 114-121). “How to Make Our Ideas Clear” (p. 124-141). Bloomington: Indiana University Press.]

Ok, so what do I gather from Peirce and my previous interpretation of Peirce? Reality exists, it causes stuff, we can define it as exactly that which causes stuff. We can never know if we definitively discovered reality in some degree, although we might have, or we could at least have come very close. Finally, reality would not be affected by our thoughts about reality.

3 view model of reality

Based upon these thoughts by Peirce, I would like to propose a model. Fundamental about this model is that it describes three different ways you can view things. All three ways are equally true and equally present at all times. However, at any one point, we could see things from just one view, having the assumptions that go along with that. The three views are:

The subjective: You could say that everything you ever experience is your own personal experience. Everything you experience is on the basis of your own senses, your own interpretations, taken place in your own body, based upon your previous experiences, etc.

The intersubjective: This is about what is shared among us. Language, values, etc. It is that something is overlapping for more people, to the extent that it is overlapping. As such, we can share the same thing, to some extent.

The objective: So basically the objective is what is unaffected by our thoughts and feelings about it. We can infer that we are born into this world and that this world has a certain structure and we can try to examine it.

The concept of “reality” can be used in some different ways and Peirce in these papers also use it in different contexts, however at least in some aspects he would perhaps say that only the 3. Objective aspect would be what is real for him. Here I will disagree with Peirce. I would say that our subjective experience or what is intersubjective is real as well. For me it is not about is it “real” or “not real” or “exist”/“not exist”, but rather about “what is the nature of the thing” or “in what way does it exist”? So for example, Spiderman is a real, existing, fictional character, known by many people.

Example of culture

Finally, in an attempt to bring home what I have written, I will try to have a brief example. Let us say that we have been having a Zoom group meeting going on. We have been meeting every week for 6 month. We are 8 people and we always show up.

In our Zoom meetings we have a designated moderator, we have an agreed on format, we have a rule that if you wish to speak you should raise your hand, we have norms about not talking too long at a time, we have a rule that if you use the word “coffee” three times in a sentence, you must pay for coffee for everyone, and a person is a designated judge if this happens.

Outside that we of course are a part of a larger culture, I would also say that there is also a culture specific for our Zoom group. If we see what we do in this Zoom meeting as culture, we could also say “let’s do it differently” and as such, we could change the culture by perhaps talking about it and then behaving differently going forward.

I will just say that between 8 people meeting in Zoom, and a larger group, let’s say a whole country, there is no qualitative difference in how culture works. Of course, a whole country is more complex, and there are many aspects that are not addressed in the 8 person group. However, all the principles remain the same. If for example, the small group should wish to move to Microsoft Teams instead of Zoom, create a new platform themselves, or meet in real life, this involves technology. If there is a certain agreed upon rule about behavior and there is a consequence if you break this rule, well this is like a law, and if you have a person moderating this Zoom meeting, well that is an institution.

Final words

I am of course interested in any comments you might have for this, but I am particularly interested in if you could tell me about Wilber’s view of “perception”? And also, do you agree with my example at the end?

You also take up “trust” as an example. However, I don’t see why it is directly relevant in a comparison between Wilber’s and my approach. However, my comment would be that I consider being in contact with reality as a prerequisite of trust and I see my own approach as more closely aligned with reality and as such I see my approach more conducive for “trust”.

Below is an AI summary I ran just to get some clarity on how perception figures into the larger discussion.

The gist of it, IMO, is Descartes is the elephant in the room, with “modernity” (according to most definitions), adhering to the Cartesian subject-object distinction. Ken Wilber did not invent the “inner-outer” distinction. He used it as an organizing principle to arrange the hundreds of existing theories he wanted to connect. The “inner-outer” distinction is all over the history of philosophy, but so are counter arguments against it. So I’m reading your work as basically trying to move beyond Descartes. That puts you in good company, because Cartesianism is generally out of favor nowadays.

What is less clear is wherein lies the emerging consensus? We can go straight to Idealism (Eastern or Western flavored) and make reality purely mental. Or we can go to materialist reductionism, as in much current scientific research into consciousness as an evolutionary emergent phenomenon. Or we can take a linguistic turn and and make conceptual thought the inevitable filter for perception, and try to cleanse those doors of perception through various means.

From the AI summary, Watts and Peirce are on different poles of anti-Cartesianism. It’s interesting that AI did in fact find some common ground. I was not sure such common ground existed between these two, which is why I took a shot in the dark with AI just to see if there was some obscure connection I was missing.


Gemini:

At first glance, Charles Sanders Peirce (the logic-driven father of pragmatism) and Alan Watts (the Zen-popularizing philosopher) seem to occupy opposite ends of the intellectual spectrum. However, they converge remarkably when it comes to how we perceive reality—specifically in their rejection of the “spectator” theory of the mind.

Here are the primary commonalities in their views on perception:

1. Perception as a Process, Not a Product

Both Peirce and Watts argued that perception is not a passive “snapshot” of an external world. Instead, it is a continuous, temporal process.

  • Peirce’s “Synechism”: Peirce believed in the principle of continuity. For him, a single moment of perception is an abstraction; reality is found in the flow of “Thirdness” (mediation and habit). We don’t just see a flash of red; we perceive it as an ongoing sign that relates to our past experiences and future actions.

  • Watts’ “Flow”: Similarly, Watts frequently used the analogy of a whirlpool to describe the self and its perceptions. He argued that there is no “thing” that perceives; there is only the “doing” of perceiving. To Watts, the “knower” and the “known” are two aspects of a single, fluid event.

2. The Rejection of Cartesian Dualism

Both thinkers were staunchly anti-dualist, though they arrived there from different directions. They rejected the idea of a “ghost in the machine” looking out through the eyes at a separate world.

  • Peirce’s Externalism: Peirce argued that “the mind is not in the head,” but rather that the human is a sign operating within a larger semiotic web. Perception is an interaction between the organism and the environment, making the boundary between “inside” and “outside” porous.

  • Watts’ Non-Dualism: Drawing from Vedanta and Zen, Watts argued that the “ego” is a social hallucination. He maintained that what we call “external” reality is actually an extension of our own sensing organs. In his view, “you” are not a subject perceiving an object; you are the entire field of perception itself.

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Someone (I think it was Bertrand Russell) once said that the power of an idea is equal to the number of things it explains divided by the number of assumptions it requires one to make.

I didn’t quite understand your critique of inner vs outer because it seemed to be more an expression of personal preference than critique to me.

Your proposed alternative seems to make a lot of assumptions about the structure of reality. For instance, that belief is a fundamental part of reality. The power of Wilber’s model, like it or not, is that it requires very few assumptions, and they seem well-founded in my mind: namely:

  • inner and outer are meaningful distinctions (your own model seems to presuppose this)
  • individual and collective are meaningful distinctions (again, these seem presupposed in your 9)
  • these are orthogonal

I think you’d need to show counterexamples to this in order to successfully critique the idea. I.e. show how orthogonality doesn’t hold for these concepts.

I have a different way of reading Peirce. What you’ve described here sounds more like Critical Realism than Peirce to me. Peirce’s Pragmatic Maxim is his most definitive statement on what can be considered real, and it’s more a description of a truth-finding algorithm than a definitive statement of what’s real and what’s not. Simply put, something can be considered true when its implications are true.

I don’t think your last statement is entirely accurate. Peirce built upon Kant’s work, which is in my understanding a rebuttal to the idea that reality is not affected by our thoughts about reality (depending on how this is meant). Stated more precisely, what we observe is not reality, it is our observation of something. I.e. what we call reality is always mediated or affected by us, as the instruments of measurement, and a class of presupposed givens that color our perceptions (Kant had 12, Peirce believed they weren’t adequately derived and so he reduced it to 3 - firstness, secondness, thirdness).

As it’s expressed in the Bṛhadāraṇyaka Upaniṣad:

“No one can understand the sounds of a drum without understanding both drum and drummer…”

I agree that it is often useful to start with the desired state and work backwards from there using backward induction/retrograde analysis. It’s also important to start with the problem, at times, in order to know you’re addressing something real. Desired change is, by definition, a future state, and therefore theoretical. Current reality is pre-theoretical in a sense, because we can all (hopefully) agree on the bad stuff we want to change (global heating, wealth inequality, mass surveillance, you name it). Of course, not everyone will view these things as equally valid concerns, but we can develop a shared understanding of these things as problems with fewer assumptions/potential disagrement.

I’m a fan of the Theory of Constraints and a set of thinking tools it includes with names like Current Reality Tree (aka Problem Tree), Future Reality Tree (aka Solution Tree), Goal Tree, Deployment Tree, and so on. It’s not necessary to always start with one of these modes of analysis; sometimes, inspiration or intuition delivers a viable solution before the problem has been fully explicated. Nonetheless, a viable goal/problem/solution/implementation will be amenable to analysis from any point of view. A solution must not be in search of a problem for too long.

Recently I wrote a textbook chapter on the future of information technology, and at the very beginning of it needed to frame the chapter by admitting that no one knows what the future holds, least of all me. So what to write about, then? The chapter basically turned into a wide-angled survey of future forecasting methodologies.

One common thread amongst these methodologies is pattern recognition of historical trends and projection of some number of such trends onto future cycles. So it turns out future navigation requires a historical view. Starting with a future vision, in effect, requires picking some available known pattern as raw material and tweaking it from there. To give a couple sci fi examples: Star Trek was conceived as a Western in space. Star Wars by contrast is samurais in space. The creators grabbed interesting history, put it in different costume, and build sets with ships and other planets. Any sort of “future” we dream up as a goal thus is really the projected memory of some past state we happen to favor.

I’m not saying this to shame anyone or claim some sort of “ah ha” revelation on my part. Just want to clarify matters for improved insight. Whatever “future” lies on the far side of the metacrisis can only be visualized as a return to some previous state we like better than what the world has on offer just now. The future as a such, however, is a Kantian unknowable thing-in-itself, of, for the spiritually minded, a deep mystery of the inscrutable divine. What is available to us here and now are the categories of our existing thought (based on experience) or the revelations vouchsafed to us from the celestial beyond.

Thanks for this. I read your response with interest but couldn’t weave the parts or snap the pieces together easily. I guess what you’re saying is that by integrating all different subjective perspectives (from whatever inner/outer vantage point) will still not yield the objective ontology. And that’s fine and I believe that Wilber would agree too.

Maybe your argument or objection is valid, but more of a philosophical one than structural?

I did an impromptu presentation on the freedom that comes from constrained systems - Georges Perec’s Oulipo school and Dave Snowden. Maybe not relevant but interesting take on (engineered) constraints.

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This all makes sense to me. Just to make myself clearer, by theoretical I meant based on some model that one must accept as a basis for argumentation. A method of forecasting change, in other words (do we see the future as samurais or cowboys, to use your analogy). Describing the present situation is comparatively less so.

I’m not familiar with Perec’s work, thanks for sharing!

Not an easy read - I can share digital books.

This brings me to all the parallel WhatsApp channel action lately on the metacrisis as Locrian and music theory in general.

(There is a back story on that. For several weeks, most of my YouTube surfing has been on geopolitics. Prior to that, on AI. Lately, I just got bored with all that and reverted to music theory, especially on microtonality. Then yesterday I got the bright idea to ask Gemini “if the metacrisis were a church mode, which one would it be?” Notice how the unconscious is pushing the conscious here …)

So yeah, why have musical scales? Because jamming on all the notes all at once sounds like a mess! So any given scale is a constraint. But even with just 12 tones (or fewer even) there is a lot of creative potential. Here’s my pragmatic takeaway (to be tested just a few hours from now in the next research call). We can conduct our discussions in the key of anything. Just pick one! Of course, accomplished musicians can run chord progressions and key changes galore without violating essential compositional unity. Rite of Spring broke all sorts of rules, but it also sort of laid down a new set of rules. My guess is we can have the conversational equivalent of tritones and diminshed scales all over the place and resolve into deeper vibrations unfamiliar in popular discourse, but finding new potentials for future exploration.

I’d generally recommend distinguishing situation from the “complication” with the situation as per SCQH (see https://issuetrees.com/).

Then you want a question which could be something like:

Why is that complication happening and what we would like to do about it (where do we want to end up)?

This would then look a lot like the symptoms + diagnosis.

That is answered in step 3 + 4 of the four step structure (“4 noble beliefs”).

That’s precisely step 4.

This is directly borrowed / derived from Wilber-ian quadrants stuff.

my understanding is that is a useful framework, not the “way the world is” and moreover the quadrants all interconnect.

I don’t know if you have read Wilber closely but i’d really recommend it as he does cover a lot of these sequences and tends to show why one simple linear sequence like this is problematic. (I’m not sure if your sequence is supposed to be hierarchical or have any kind of sequencing).

That’s a very broad definition of culture. I’d stick with something a bit more precise e.g. from the cultural evolution deck we shared in the course https://cultural-evolution-paradigmatic-change-rufuspollock.flowershow.me/

Culture is the shared views, values, beliefs and norms that bond and organise human groups — and shape how we perceive reality itself.

If you can get any kind of control over that system (or even just autonomy as a teacher within it) then it definitely would be. My sense is that the current academy is like the Catholic church of the late medieval period: a great and corrupted institution that is too far gone to be reformed. Academia (as institution) is the institution of modernity. I don’t see much hope for reform from within.

Back in the '80s I was a graduate student at Stanford. (Clueless - buy hey - I got into Stanford!). In any case, a remark I overheard from one of the professors was very telling. It went something like this: “Universities are better at being museums for culture than they are at creating culture”.

Actually in that era, culture was indeed being radically created in and around Stanford. The Home Brew Computing Club, for example. All that kind of went over my head at the time, however. But the tension between being a real academic (and getting paid for it) and true culture-creation (through all manner of alternative formats) has been my constant companion down through the decades.

The way I’m working it here is using this forum and other 2R spaces as a culture-creation studio. But then I publish some of it academically and get paid too! In my forthcoming textbook for example, I cite John Vervaeke on the meaning crisis, Nate Hagens on the carbon pulse, and @rufuspollock on open source. So yes, it is possible to hang out on the liminal web, scoop up good ideas, and “can” them for general academic distribution.