This is another Part from my gist here: Cross CRoss Collaboration · Issue #1355 · life-itself/community · GitHub
I will copy the relevant part and extend from there a bit
Eco System maps and mapping
I also do find mapping very interesting a couple of observations.
At some point I was trying to communicate with you about possible tanged and even overlapping projects between lifeitself and web3 like for example kernel:
The kernel book is a static piece of software, many of the links are now broken, we need concepts to avoid these things if possible.
Same thing - same thing! - with your ecosystem maps or other links ( like your christopher alexander talk issue here on github). Some Link checker scripts could easily help here. Federated P2P content organisation also.
With the agartha crypto ecosystem map from 2022 we can see that it is located in the solar punk layer. Which is I think a good layer with good possible connections to lifeitself.
Did you read some of andys writings? like this?
e class="onebox allowlistedgeneric" data-onebox-src="https://andytudhope.africa/essays/languaging-llms/">
The Sincere Path
Nothing could enter it but the sincere act
OR this interview where he talks about what his work is - IS:
So many people, so many .. of them they are still talking in these obsolete categories: business case, marketing and so on…
In part kernel already offered some of the things that you outlined for your developmental space:
Kernel was running in blocks usually 8 weeks up to 100 people. The setup with the alumni was also in place. They run it for more then 8 Blocks!
I think there could be quite somethings to be exchanged and learned from. In some sense I think people are loooking deeply for connection and resonance, and the ecosystems maps are important hints for them to find opportunities to meet likewise people.
from web3 to weco back story leading to david rug - perspective on weco and the interbrain as possible developmental spaces platforms
One of the web3 projects that I was involved with over with kernel was also AKASHA, here is a session where they hosted weco:
weco was not build on web3 tech. James and Laurence had some very interesting ideas and you can see that they are inspired also by aspects of integral - holons. Concepts like - the glassbead game. See my zettel below:
How to play the glass bead game
- #tags: #glass_bead_game #practice
- source:
- The Regenaissance - A Metamodern Playbook - Google Docs
- quote:
- "The Glass Bead Game is the gamification of the truth process.
- The truth process is the synergy of all perspectives.
- The GBG offers a serious play structure for truth seekers to sincerely explore topics together.
- Players choose a topic – a bead – and take time-limited turns – 2 minutes, 1 minute, 30 seconds – to improvise an unfiltered flow of cocreation.
- A great turn expresses the most truth in the smallest space, and intertwines closely with the previous turn. But a great player knows when to redirect the flow, when to reflect back, when to ask questions, and when to increase or decrease the level of abstraction.
- The aim of the game is to develop conceptual clarity, deep listening, game awareness, post-ego interactivity, and rhetorical skill to best participate in the collective intelligence of humanity."
- playing with Laurence attention we { collective }
- andy signs life we { collective }
Still weco platform never reached critical mass. Interesting people did meet. James went eventually to coasys and I hope and think its a critical step towards resilience: P2P holochain, agentic ( local!) interfaces, which we need so badly in our decaying societies. One initiative that was kind of still running through weco was the world wise web. specifically david rugs work.
This is Davids youtube channel :
last year david published something interesting he was announcing or - asking - for the Interbrain project:
The InterBrain - How Collective DreamWeaving Can Heal the World
He got some funding on open collective:
and started working on it.
His idea on - looking AT the lens rather only through it - I think thats for sure an interesting idea. What do you think?
Finally the code is somehow working with obsidian:
I think something like the glass bead game or Davids dream talk can be a valuable addition to the toolkit of - sensible online communication.
David has pitched his tool to some - various? crypto communities. But as these tech people go they rather stick to themselves, it would need a lot of - integral - cross - cross - collaboration and explanation of (integral) concepts to bring these sense making tools into the wider communities.
Changes in information ecology for consumer internet
Why do you have these as contacts options on your website?:
- Substack
- Instagram !"!!
- linkedIn ??? I Verified My LinkedIn Identity. Here's What I Actually Handed Over. | THE LOCAL STACK I Verified My LinkedIn Identity. Here’s What I Actually Handed Over.
- and whats app?
- github…
If I see the values you agree with, I can see that I agree with many of them, but choosing these platforms has implications. When I ask my self why would he choose those for people to interact? I think I can see the answer and it goes something like : convenience and adoption.
Coasys is based on Holochain but first lets dig a little into alternative Social media a bit.
When X became twitter a lot of things happened, and now x is basically a transhumanist propaganda machine that promotes techno feudalism in favor of elon musk.
But Jack Dorsey went to build bluesky and it some regards it finally succeed. Bluesky opened up the protocol and now you can do different things while still adhering to social media protocols.
Blogging? first it was google blogger, then medium. They went through different phases of enshittification:
And yes this is one pattern of civilizational decline that we now - also - need to work against…
After medium substack came, but essentially its keeps the - consumer patterns. ( user create content but platforms owns data and meta data)
So bluesky , at least offers leaflet so you can blog with your: blue/black/euro sky account:
Instagram: many friends and parts of my extended family tell me about this thing: this app sucks out my life, it turns me into a zombie.
I hope I don’t have to explain here things like - the social dilemma documentation - Meta is run by marc, and yes marc wants to be a elon with all the following transhumanist tendencies and other paradoxical world views. There are cruel things to be said real cruel things that happened because of Meta. So I think it makes sense to avoid software by meta as much as possible.
Rufus did you ever talk to aral?
*sky offers - plug-able algorithms so people do not get sucked into polarization or doom scrolling.
So while full P2P resilience is not quite there, All the content that you create on github!! ( ms did train on aLL the code…) an otherwise could be linked , shared or integrated with in the bluesky ecosystem which is quite big, they have a lot of users!
Even more community alignment - thank you integral!
Quick detour from bluesky!
Over the last years I also found the book: Reinventing Organisations https://www.goodreads.com/de/book/show/20787425-reinventing-organizations
Which tries to apply some of the Integral concepts to Organisatiosn. Such that you might say, Organisations themselves become developmental spaces Some interesting examples in the book include for the mondragon corporation in spain.
Group Chat with Roomy
Coming back to bluesky!
Originally I came to some other web3 community to roomy and muni-town. The https://muni.town/ discord or now roomy chat, is a community which technically rooted in the world of the ATPRotocol / Bluesky but their organisational design and principles are in my opinion very much that what was described in reinventing organisations. Its very much open and offers different options for collaboration. So they know their technical stuff but not yet all interesting things that could be even expanded to what in the book/integral framework would be called a teal organisation. So maybe erlend could be someone that could be interesting for you to talk to in a future podcast about the future of organisations and developmental spaces. Here is a real chance to talk about technology, people and values.
Of course with a *sky account the roomy groupchat can be used as another puzzle into the direction more human centric technology.
Now with AI so many things are changing its hard to compress it here into text. But one of the things musk did was to create grokpedia:
there you can read about his ideas of climate change and ideal governments (monarchy?)
But the things is I recently heard.. its not written for humans, with this thing he has quite the big influence on the AI models which scrape the net.
Google which poisoned together with meta the web through advertising, is dying the age of search engines is coming to an end.
LLMs exponentially become the “interface” for people to access information AND computation. You probably have heard of the first geo political implications. So local resilient strategies still make sense.
Why is there a science - revival - open /DeSci ? what are the deeper issues ?
Bluesky and Atproto also have efforts to improve science. https://atproto.science/ some of these link back directly to weco I mentioned above. So another huge lever to bring developmental spaces forward are these place where people gather and they would be interested in the original? spirit of science, inhabiting a sense of joyful curiosity to explorer but deeply wounded by institutions and other forms of money. Do you know the essentia foundation, bernado kastrup and their work in that context. In a sense I perceive them also as a developmental space and so I was also wondering a bit to not see them on your ecosystem map?
I was pondering to post a tangent of this in mars post but decided to put it here, still I will now tag @Mars here.
Mars mentioned Instagram, and I explained some of the problems i have with meta above. We should not use it, spend as little time and interaction with these things as possible
I could share personal stories of humans I know who told me: “this app sucks the life out of me”
Please not.
So now for the more positive bits. Again as I described above AtProto offers nice alternatives in so many ways. Let me share another story related to roomy.
I was initially drawn to roomy because of the potential to create static content from chat content.
Erlend ( muni.town) describes this phenomenon here:
a chat as minimum-viable anything
Chat is a superior community starter
You may have experienced this which your focus on whatsapp? @rufuspollock
From weco ( see above) I knew Ronen Tamari and his concept of stigmergy
Ronen recently tried to make his vision of a more semantic overlay to the web work also using AtProto. His project is called semble:
Now since roomy has become mature enough I was thinking if maybe the static content or tagging of chats could be used for semble. And so I brought up this idea to ronen and the muni.town guys and it looks like they will make it happen. This is important in multiple ways.
I also mentioned above that LLMs quickly become the main - interface - for people to the internet. We can see this for example with search: Googles revenue is now stedily declining since 2022. This has many implications : the big web indices are not comercially viable to maintain. But with the technology of semble we can also build decentralized indices. So I think this is something that will help us to get more resilient information structures.
If search is freed from advertising many avenues open up, even if we have to work with contraints.
I will try to explain this using the eco system mapping ( see gist ) but also reaching out for communities - see maria montessori post.
The lifeitself map is a nice project , agartha also build a nice one :
The idea goes soemthing like this: how can these mappings be made more accessible to a wider audicence and how can participants in the ecosystem add to the mappings themselves.
With the Technology I described above, chats in roomy ( or discord via bridge), posts from a forum, or other sources, they all can contribute to a open index( semble already has a search feature, there is also freedom browser from florian glatz an other projects)
#Games
I also see great potential for these games that create resonance , I mentioned the glass bead game above but also the itnerbrain from David rug.
Also you have created a nice wiki, but ass you mentioned there was also the GameB wiki. So
Some questions could go like this:
How could this information made available to decentralized search indicies like semble?
How to go beyond mere - information/concepts - but create : actionable maps
Include Events - roomy has open meet events included create options such that grass root movements such as community gardening get much more visibility.
@rufuspollock do you think its possible to talk to David? It could be a fun experience to use his interbrain/dream talk for the conversation. 
